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      What Kind Of People Will We Be?

      3 months ago

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      To me, hate for the opposition has grown in the last 10 years, especially with the extremists in the Republican Party. The Tea Party "no holds barred" rhetoric; show hosts like Sean Hannity, Laura Ingraham, Russ Limbaugh; writings like Breitbart and others; and a President who lacks civility and morals has made these supporters "mob think" and hate all who they consider "liberals" and Democrat. And it is so sad for our country.

      https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2018/10/...

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          Peggy Gaston Ledbetter
          2 months ago

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          It wasn't tea party people that were violent at Trump's rally's. Its not tea partiers being arrested outside the supreme court building. Its not tea partiers who went to Hillary's rally's and beat anyone. Its not republicans who oppose at all costs. I don't know who put you on such a high pedestal or who "theatlantic.com" might be, but your simply wrong.


          We can't put a Trump bumper sticker on our car without it and the car being vandalized. No one has complained about their Hillary bumper sticker being a problem. Have you read any of Breitbart and others? Do you listen to Rush Limbaugh or Hannity? No, you don't. Do you listen to Maxine Waters who thinks its a great idea to get in white house staff faces and refuse them service. No republican has said such a thing. Does she and you not see or understand what getting into peoples faces does, the invitation to violence that is? Does she not realize the presidents job is to enforce the laws passed by congress. The president does not create laws, change laws and if Trump starts writing his own and enforces them over the laws passed by congress, I'll be calling him names too. And not vote for him next time.


          That's what I did for Obama. Obama speaks well, and broke nearly every promise he made and lied about keeping the insurance plan we liked for the price we get it at. I no longer have insurance thanks to Obama. Because of ACA, the premiums have quadrupled, the penalty tax that the new tax code did away with, cost me $2000 from my return. The lesser of the two evils and extortion made legal by Obama.


          Then there is DACA. Which contradicts immigration laws, it is an illegal order. The other is only congress can levy taxes or give an agency the power to collect fees and what the fees are. DACA was never legislated, and it cost $495 to apply. Lasting only two years, many of the 800,000+ applicants were on their second and third times around. At the end of two years, another $495 to renew. DACA did nothing for legal status. Trump's order to end this illegal Obama order was a proper order. Anyone who says Trump doesn't have the authority to end it is partially right. Obama didn't have the authority to create it. Claiming broad powers over immigration when announcing it. Giving time for congress to legislate a version, made Trump's order fair. So do the math...$495 X 800,000 X 2. Where is the money?


          When isn't Trump civil? He is blunt at times, maybe even crude at times, and when confronted with a problem, tend to go over the top. And after some thinking, he'll call the person and have a civil chat. Could you have a civil chat with him? Most here claim they just want to slap the president. If you read the replies, agreeing with anything bad about the president, still singing the "when Mueller finds..." blues. Still unable to fill in the blank, just because no one here can say in their own words why they hate Trump. Why they oppose even when he is doing the job, opposing the laws passed by congress as he tries to enforce them. That is what California does everyday. The liberal democrat majority. They break immigration laws, allow illegal and non-citizens to vote. Breaking constitutional law. All the while claiming its Trump that is damaging democracy. In this universe, NOTHING is preserved by breaking it. And breaking constitutional law, allowing non-citizens to vote, giving illegals welfare, is how you make the constitution words on a page. Impeaching the duly elected president with no evidence is not how democracy is saved, its how its destroyed along with innocent until proven guilty and not being punished unless FOUND guilty in a court of law.


          Have you not noticed all judging Kavanaugh because of who appointed him? Not many actually looking at his resume, the 97+% decisions in agreement with other judges on the appeals panel. Less than 3% dissenting. Ford lied. I do not believe her. She brought nothing to back her up. She sounded more like the Iran-Contra hearing with all the not remembering. Including what day she did a polygraph. And her magic appearing lawyers that paid for the polygraph test. But did they record the statement she made and her answer the two questions the tech asked her? And submit it to committee or CNN or anyone. Not that I recall or heard about. Because THAT statement would be the only statement she passed. She couldn't bring the doctors notes that she told about the attack in 2012 why? Because there was other sensitive information. And the notes couldn't be photocopied and redacted of the other information and brought along?? There is only one reason why Feinstein did what she did. Far from civility, her dishonorable actions of using this claim because so many have just resigned rather than demand the evidence and fight the claim. Evidently, the FBI report didn't find anything or anyone to support Ford's claim.


          Kavanaugh's decisions have been by the book, and followed precedent. And in agreement with the other judges 97% of the time. But, did anyone question that? No. What is the reputation of the judges he agrees with 97% of the time? Nobody knows. What decision made it to a higher court and was overturned? You don't know. What was his dissenting opinions? You don't know. Oh, I know, let's judge him on who appointed him and an accuser who can't remember anything and punish him for what can't be proven. With witnesses named, but none will support her. Maybe the million dollars she got in GoFundMe accounts will make her all better. Yeah, lets judge him on those things because no one DARE to call a woman making claims of a sexual assault a liar or demand due process and evidence. Anyone that dare demand their civil rights and due process is automatically guilty, right?


          You do these things and like little kids, its not you. Its the teacher that hates you. Its republicans that hate you. That we take pleasure in your pain of doing all you can to see this nation crash and burn rather for Trump to have any measure of success. No matter how much it may benefit the country, its opposed. Trump enforcing the laws passed by congress is opposed. Which means your opposing the rule of law.


          Define moral. Sex outside of marriage was immoral, is it still? You couldn't say pregnant on tv a while ago, now they show you how to get pregnant leaving little to the imagination. Seldom is moral and politician used in the same sentence. Divorce was immoral. Abortion, you call anti-abortionists pro-life. Why don't you call those who favor abortion pro-death? Its a better description of what the opposite of pro-life is, isn't it? Its what abortion is, isn't it? So what is moral?? Pro-life, or pro-death? Oh, I almost forgot, its not pro-death. Its sugar coated into pro-choice. The choice was made when a woman consented to have sex. I will give (as if its mine to give) the right to abortion. But the government should not pay for it.


          I don't know why you think people get off on being cruel. I know some do. But, I never understood people like that. I tend to veer away from people like that. Which is why I'm republican and not a democrat. That doesn't mean I hate democrats. The democrat party is making a heavy left turn for socialism. Read your party platform. I have read them both. Hillary hoping the democrats take power and wanting a one party government. Sound familiar? The banning of any other political party?? Who else has such dreams?? Lenin, Stalin, Saddam, more recently Chavez and the person the won on the one name ballot for president of Venezuela. Those running against him telling their own people not to vote for them. The average Venezuelan losing 24 lbs for lack of food. And nobody cares. Its the path democrats want to take because it did create equality. 80% poverty equal. Created a one party system where political rivals are arrested, families threatened. Creating the new elite of the country, those at the top of the one party. The wealth gap, the all important wealth gap is far greater in socialism. Venezuela had 24% poverty before socialism and Chavez who was hailed a hero by many celebrities and democrats. Sorry I just see him as such.


          Nazi's thought they had the moral high ground also. So does ISIS, al-Qaeda, the Taliban, jihadists, whose goal is to destroy the infidels. We once believed democracy and freedom were the cornerstone of our principles. When Obama and Hillary called for the Egyptian president elect to be arrested, then I knew the value of democracy Obama has. Zero. Calling for the impeachment of the president with NO supporting evidence is the same, if not worse.


          I was invited to this then forum by Mr. Mike Horton. It then went from a place of sharing ideas to close minded resist at all costs, hate fest. And yes, it is sad. Because if democrats would work with republicans, as the president asked when he took office, Trump's good ideas could have been added to and made better. The conversations here could be civil.

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              Peggy Gaston Ledbetter
              3 months ago

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              As an elderly foreigner who has visited the US many times, I think I can say that nothing like what is going on now used to happen.

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                  Ian Miller
                  3 months ago

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                  I wish that I could reassure you, but I cannot. I think Americans remain who they have always been. The good still exists, but those who hate have been empowered by a president who rewards and encourages their anger.

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