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Centrist Discussions for the 60% in the Middle

BridgeTourJade From The Middle Of The Atlantic

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      The Trump Descriptor of the day:

      Useful Idiot

      The Russians Electronic warfare always need a "useful idiot" in order for their operations to succeed. Useful Idiot Donnie is their best weapon against the USA.

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      The Rising Tide Of Purple Voters Assists The Blue Wave

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          Several years ago I posted my concern of the rise of White Nationalist violence leading to partisan fighting. Trump has only made the situation worse. The TrumpGOP followers are now forced to defend the indefensible and undeniable cruelty exercised by this administration.

          In return for something like an extra few bucks, if the poor GOP members get anything at all.

          The encouraging news is the growing number of "Purple" voters - GOP moderates voting Blue.

          "...latest results of the so-called generic ballot question of who people are more likely to vote for in their district: Democrats lead. Among all registered voters, Democrats led by 6 percentage points (50 to 44 percent), but among likely voters, the Democratic advantage is 9 percentage points. That is a range that can mean trouble in the House for Republicans, said pollster Lee Miringoff, director of the Marist Institute for Public Opinion, which conducted the poll." - NPR

          The GOP Purple Voters also may reduce the possibilities of sectarian and/or partisan unrest. The gross anger of losing their foothold on the American Leadership ladder will likely fuel the engine of White Nationalist and other nativist organizations, with lone wolves like the Kansas Trio - self named "The Crusaders" - who claim that Trump motivated them to plan to attack the Somalis they targeted.

          According to reports, the Christian terrorists were big supporters of Trump, hated Hillary Clinton, despised Muslim refugees, and wanted to “wake people up” and “start a race war.” - AP

          AP also reported that their lawyers filed a sentencing brief that inclyded: "The court cannot ignore the circumstances of one of the most rhetorically mold-breaking, violent, awful, hateful and contentious presidential elections in modern history, driven in large measure by the rhetorical China shop bull who is now our president."

          The TrumpGOP is losing the support of the fee remaining GOP Moderates every day, and as each one defects, the Deplorables will become more desperate.

          https://www.npr.org/2018/10/31/662216598/another-c...

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          Pundit Post

          Is Lying A Violation Of Morality?

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              This site has a widely diverse population, with widely divergent views. All views are welcome in this conversation Civility is an expected standard of participation.

              This post is NOT to have a pie fight. Trump is not even a tangential subject for this interaction.This post is an invitation to simply present, and defend your views on the question posed. It is NOT to have a discussion, besides confirmation or refutation as a reply/comment
              to agree or disagree with a position posited. The highest standard of professional writing is expected. I will be
              disappointed if someone chooses to fail that standard. I believe that we sometimes disregard the reality that we are a pretty intelligent bunch, and would hope to prove that with such posts as this here.

              I look forward to the responses. I will post mine, as well. Later. Take your time, and think about your response.

              It will definitely help the conversation. Please don't feel first the need to defend your post, but simply post a
              reply. The purpose is for us to think, not write other than our thoughts. I hope you will accept this challenge.

              Heteronomy versus autonomy is an interesting viewpoint to examine in this question, I think. (Just an invitation. not a requirement.)

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              Trump Needs His White Nationalists Attacking America Or Lose His Base

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                  It is an inconvenient truth that White Fear played a large part in the 2016 race. There are those here who are claiming that it was about economics only, the SCOTUS only, immigration only, corruption only, abortion only.


                  They are still wrong.

                  One only needs to review the words of one of the hating right:

                  Our Glorious Leader has ascended to God Emperor. Make no mistake about it: we did this. If it were not for us, it wouldn’t have been possible. ... [T]he White race is back in the game. And if we’re playing, no one can beat us. The winning is not going to stop.” - Day-Stormer owner Andrew Angelin

                  The owner of the #1 Alt-Right site (when I originally posted this article) also stated earlier this year (2016) “Jews, Blacks and lesbians will be leaving America if Trump gets elected – and he’s happy about it. This alone is enough reason to put your entire heart and soul into supporting this man.”

                  Voting for any single member of Despicable Donnie's TrumpGOP is done with bloody hands.


                  GS Jade Barrett, Chairman SANE60

                  #TheResistance #indivisible #resist

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                  Pundit Post

                  250 Years

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                      We have, in the past 250 years experienced more amazing industrial and technological moments than in all the years of previous history. Just take a moment to consider where we have come as a people, as a nation, and as a world since those halcyon days of 1768.

                      But, have we?

                      in 2018, is there no (longer) a need for morality? For compassion? For democracy?

                      Adam Smith, an historical moral philosopher, talked to us a very, very long time ago about the need to sustain several things. Sustainable development is a new buzz word; I would submit an important one. This does, however tend to be an almost exclusively economic term. Smith would not understand the implications, although were he to walk the piers of any major port in the world he would be pleased. Turning to the people manning the work of those ports, however I believe Smith would cry. here's a quick snapshot of Smith and his work:

                      https://www.investopedia.com/updates/adam-smith-ec...

                      In Smith's day, philosophy (moral, political, economic, human) was closely tied to and was actually a part of the study of economics. It seems funny (not "Ha ha!") to me that his legacy was borne in a world of study which began with economics and ended with morality and ethics in philosophy. "Should governments intervene in the dynamics of economics? Morality?"

                      He was a revolutionary in every sense of the word. He had ferocious and high velocity, high voice detractors and thus, a conversation crashed onto the world stage. It continues to this very moment. If you were to attempt to create a Venn Diagram (as I have recently had to do for a course I will be teaching next year on-line if I make it that long), you would be incredibly challenged to limit that diagram to the conversations Smith's manuscripts created.

                      Looking at this dilemma from the limited scope of the past 250 years is a most challenging task, if for no reason other than the simple magnificent vistas such a limit empowers. There is a great, relatively short video offering a view into this particular diagram. I highly recommend it to you, with a caveat:

                      Smith didn't know what the conversations he began would become.

                      In 2018, we mostly do. What we do not know is how the conversation will end. Smith advocated for a limited government when he wrote his three seminal works. I wonder what he would say, given the world of this day, and the political governments who exert power in it.

                      Personally, I think he would argue against himself on those scores in the world of today. Bentham is still wrong today as he was when he tried to institute limitations not only upon governments but upon people as well. Nevertheless, the world of that time is no more, and the world of this time may well be on the way to join them.

                      Voting today represents many things, for instance. Who would have ever conceived of the notion that voting in the world today is a very, and completely spiritual matter. My research wanderings led this progressive liberal democrat through some amazing lands, indeed. I hope they will continue to. I think this will be a most amazing course. I know for certain it certainly has been for the author of it.

                      250 years is much more than a line segment through the course of recorded history. We get to choose how we leave it, and lead it in our own nation. The world may, or may not take notice. The notice that world may take may give us credence and credibility again. It could also point to this very moment in time as the time the United States proved itself completey unworthy of respect, dignity or recognition by any more being on the planet.

                      We may, or may not get to choose the outcome. That is entirely up to us. Smith didn't trust us. Bentham didn't believe us. That crazy Frenchman who came on a holiday to America and stayed for more than two years didn't hope for us, but he dreamed for us. De Tocqueville had many things to say about us. If we leave his words there, we fail him. He cried with hope for us. His land was split from his day until this one hoping for democracy.

                      We are about to hit the moment where we will become one of the longest surviving continuous democratic governments (in continual existence mind you) in the history of the world.

                      Are we so engrossed in proving ourselves, and our "side" that none of them can be right? If the history of the past 250 years can teach us anything, perhaps not. Are we still the guardians of this amazing journey, of this amazing experiment?

                      Unfortunately, from where I stand at this particular moment in time, I cannot say. And, the unfortunate truth I can offer to you is that only time will tell.


                      Here's something YOU can do about it:

                      https://compassionit.com/30daychallenge/

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                      Bombs, Trump & The Truth

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                          Can we truthfully say today’s events are something we didn’t expect to happen? For that matter, does anyone here on the forum expect Trump to step up to the challenge and tell his base, what happened today is not at all what he is about? And have his rabid supporters, stop the chanting of “lock her up,” when it starts?

                          I believe I know the answers to my questions. Because we have Donald J. Trump Nationalist sitting behind The Resolute Desk, who is acting like a wannabe demigod far more than the leader of the free world.

                          Before I continue, take a moment and ponder these questions, what makes the United States a leader in the free world? What is it about this country, that draws other individuals to its shores? What is it about the make-up of the body politic that entices others to want to come here to become citizens of the United States? Could it be this?

                          How brave a thing is freedom of speech, which has made the Athenians so far exceed every other state of Hellas in greatness!'

                          Is it possible people from other countries viewed the US as the ancient Greek philosophers like Plato, Aristotle, and Socrates saw Athens as a bastion of freedom of speech?

                          Many factors beckon people to leave their home countries to come here in the hopes of becoming citizens of the US. No need to cover them all, but, freedom of speech by far is one of the main ones. With our free speech, we have a free press able to speak truth to power as stated in our first amendment:

                          Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press, or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

                          Freedom of speech, or of the press. This short sentence troubles Trump. We cannot look past his constant refrain ‘the press is the enemy of the people’ the result of his constantly saying that at his rallies, often result in those in attendance yelling and screaming at those in the press pen. Who frankly, are there to do their job, which is to cover and report out on the rally.

                          Trump makes these statements, revels in the crowd’s adulation for throwing the red meat they seem to want. For the most part, people do the chanting and hooting and hollering; it makes them feel good, they got to show their support for their guy. On their travel home I never thought some might contemplate making bombs to murder people. However, today, I wonder.

                          Two weeks ago we had the murder of Jamal Khashoggi an American resident and reporter. Mr. Khashoggi left his beloved Saudi Arabia because he feared that his writing would get him in trouble with the Crown Prince, Mohammed bin Salman who like Trump has little love for the press how brave a thing is freedom of speech.” Brave enough for individuals like Mr. Khashoggi to leave his country so he could have the opportunity to implore MBS in the form of mild criticism to do more in the way of reforms. However, instead of accepting it seems he Mr. Khashoggi killed. Why? Like Trump has a thin skin and can’t handle the truth when it’s pointed out them.

                          Alexis de Tocqueville came to the US to learn how this new form nation would handle their experiment in democracy in which they embarked.

                          The gradual development of the equality of conditions is therefore a providential fact. It has the essential characteristics of one: it is universal, durable, and daily proves itself to be beyond the reach of man’s powers. Not a single event, not a single individual, fails to contribute to its development. Is it wise to believe that a social movement that originated so far in the past can be halted by the efforts of a single generation? Does anyone think that democracy, having destroyed feudalism and vanquished kings, will be daunted by the bourgeois and the rich? Will it stop now that it has become so strong and its adversaries so weak? Where are we headed, then? No one can say, because we have no basis for comparison. Already today conditions among Christians are more equal than they have ever been at any previous time anywhere in the world. Thus the magnitude of what has been done already prevents us from anticipating what can still be done. - Alexis de. Tocqueville: Democracy in America

                          Not for a moment do I think Trump has read de Tocqueville’s Democracy in America. Had he, he might have an understanding of how he should be a protector of something as fragile as the concept of democracy. Instead, he is taking cues on leadership from people like Putin, Erdogan, and Duterte all autocrats, the people he likes. Who are shall we say, a bit impervious to democracy not to mention, no fans of the press let alone the concept of free speech.

                          Since Trump has a significant problem with the truth and those who received bombs are individuals he derides at his rallies, is it unreasonable that people are drawing a line to his rally rhetoric to bombs suddenly being delivered to those he has derided?

                          Having the privilege to sit behind the Resolute Desk, carries with it a responsibility to people of this country, to borrow a phrase from the TV Series Green Arrow, “Donald J. Trump you have failed this country.”


                          https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2018/10/24/b...

                          https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/24/nyregion/clinto...

                          https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/24/world/middleeas...

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                          Secret GOP Meetings Create Final Solution For Medicare - Kill The Old #2

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                              With the 2018 Midterms looming large, those citizens troubled by the potential elimination of their healthcare and the lives of those suffering from ill health and threatening life conditions have the opportunity to defend their ground with their vote. If you need to be reminded where the GOP leadership stands, a review of this updated piece from June of 2017 should help - BTJ, 16 Oct 2018

                              Ever since Mitch "Eichmann" McConnell required the GOP to channel their inner Khymer Rouge last month (May 2017 - BTJ), the Republican Senate's plans have been left up to the imagination.

                              With an effort to reduce American Life expectancy by decades, Senator McConnell has taken Trump's copy of Mein Kampf, added a final solution or two and mixed in the support of the subhuman Deplorables. Extracting the DNA of a snapping turtle to genetically alter his appearance, Mitch may soon be donning a Nazi WWII helmet to complete the new look for the leading haters of Americans - the United States Senate's Republicans.

                              Reducing the American population by 20 million or so will impact the healthcare system certainly, bankrupting patients and former caregivers alike. The economic travesty of eliminating Medicare, the Veterans Administration hospitals, Social Security and all other forms of federal subsidies to the Healthcare system - except for those owned by say, Tim Price, who has repeatedly proven in the past that he is a very good friend to the companies he holds shares of - is nearly beyond stupefying. Keep in mind that the Kentucky Senator has already been experimenting on his constituents in his home state for over a decade.

                              One of the conclusions that can be drawn is that the systemic elimination of the old, the infirm and the injured is a necessity for GOP success. Though the Party of Ignorance fails to recognize that their razor thin majority is the most likely to succumb first.

                              So perhaps that is a good thing.

                              In conjunction with eliminating the immigration of tens of thousands of future Healthcare workers, the GOP should be able to passively execute millions of their followers over the next four years.

                              No one ever accused the GOP Conservative element of being good long term planners. Proudly failing at predicting the future for decades, they continue to successfully disappoint the nation.

                              Now for those of you interested in the 2018 elections, there are more than a few organizations who are also key players beyond the party affiliation. Perhaps familiesusa.org is worth a look, and this question in particular:

                              "Part 1: Does your candidate support or
                              oppose repeal of the Affordable Care Act?
                              Last year, Congress came within just a couple of votes
                              of repealing the federal health care law. The 2017
                              repeal bill would not have preserved all of the federal
                              protections for people with preexisting conditions
                              and would have taken health care coverage away
                              from millions of people with preexisting conditions.
                              Candidates who support protections for people with
                              preexisting conditions will oppose repeal of the
                              Affordable Care Act.
                              If your congressional representative is running for re-
                              election this year, see how he or she voted on health
                              care repeal in 2017: See how members of the House
                              of Representatives voted. See how Senators voted.
                              If your candidate was not in Congress last year, or is
                              running for state office, ask the candidate directly,
                              “Would you support or oppose repeal of the Affordable
                              Care Act?”" - from the familiesusa.org website.

                              The SANE60 recommends taking the time to evaluate your candidate's stand on Healthcare. Are they out to diminish or destroy your healthcare options? - BTJ

                              https://familiesusa.org/blog/2018/10/2018-federal-...


                              GS Jade Barrett, Chairman SANE60

                              #resist #indivisible

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                              Pundit Post

                              Sometimes An Unruly Gathering Is The Answer To A Nation's Troubles

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                                  Frankly I do not care one whit what an individual's political party affiliation is. I do not even care if they are independent. What I do care about it is if they exercise their right to do something about how they feel.

                                  Now Trump has made every effort to galvanize the Left - which would be anyone who is not part of his personal inner circle - and for that we owe the man a debt of gratitude.

                                  The Left is not just the Democrat, but anyone who believes that we, as a nation, have a moral and ethical responsibility to support those in need. Trump himself has taken advantage of extreme weather damage to Mar-A-Lago, for as we have discovered before, everyone is a Socialist in a hurricane. I would like to point out that the resort received a fair amount of dollars (17 million, give or take, back in 2005) despite the lack of any evidence of destruction at the property. That would not be much of a surprise, given the sense of entitlement that Trump owns.

                                  "Two years after a series of storms, the real estate tycoon said he didn’t know how much had been spent on repairs but acknowledged he pocketed some of the money. Trump transferred funds into his personal accounts, saying that under the terms of his policy, “you didn’t have to reinvest it.” - AP, as reported in Fortune Magazine, October 24 2016.


                                  Reinvest it? Trump did not even have to prove the basis for acquiring "it".

                                  But I digress.

                                  Every petty outrage adds to our collective sense of rage with the current administration - from Trump's organized crime connections to the hiring of undocumented workers to the nonsensical and capricious application of tariffs upon our favored trading partners and allies. His relentless assault on the freedoms and legal protections of any one who is not wealthy enough to be classified as a "White"Billionaire is a daily occurrence, for it is the rare day that the "Man Who Would Be A Despot" does not take some action to inflict harm on his fellow - and lesser - man.

                                  His behavior is not limited to Democrats, but to all citizens whether they are his fans or foes. He simply acts to gain the adoration of his Deplorables and the fiscal seal of approval from his ownership. Trump truly looks upon his fellow countrymen and women with utter disdain.

                                  History is rife with examples of a population rising up to protest - and in some cases, remove - the authoritarian throne holder. There are a few parallels that might be drawn that would not surprise the true heroes of the USA as they continue to combat the tyranny of #45. As in King George III's description of "the Deluded Americans", which so aptly defines the few Trump supporters that remain loyal to the extremely flawed President. King George III declared it his duty to stand fast against the Americans in "the battle of the legislature" and "withstand every attempt to weaken or impair" his sovereign authority. After Yorktown, the English King realized the need to abdicate, making him the last European Ruler of America.

                                  At least George had the good sense to depart, his armies defeated by an unruly mob, mortally weary of the injustices taken against their home, livelihoods and religion.

                                  And that was a good and righteous thing.

                                  Keep in mind the MLK and Gandhi utilized a unified and nonviolent mob to change their respective nations.

                                  GS Jade Barrett, Chairman SANE60

                                  #TheResistance #indivisible #resist


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